Speaker 1: 

Welcome to Digital-First Leadership. The podcast that focuses on helping leaders and teams understand  how to master the language of social media in today's digital first world. 

Richard Bliss: 

Welcome to the show. I'm your host, Richard Bliss. You're listening to Digital-First Leadership, a podcast where I talk to guests that have experience with this whole world of digital online presence, whether that's a leadership or engaging with our customers and prospects. And today is no different. I have a  very special guest. All my guests are special, but today it's a little different. It's a little bit more special.  My guest is Shep Hyken. Now Shep is fairly unique, because he's done a lot of things in the world. But one thing he is a customer service and experience expert, as well as a Wall Street Journal, New York  Times, best-selling author and an award-winning keynote speaker. Shep, thanks for joining me. 

Shep Hyken: 

It is great to be here and thanks for that introduction. You would've made my mother very proud. 

Richard Bliss: 

It was like you wrote it yourself. It was amazing. And what special is that not only all these things, but I  also like to think that you're my friend. And so that's one of the nice things. 

Shep Hyken: 

I am and you're my friend. 

Richard Bliss: 

Yeah. And so that 

Shep Hyken: 

We got to know each other. We're not like old friends, but it feels like it. 

Richard Bliss: 

Yeah, we're old and we're friends. 

Shep Hyken: 

There you go. 

Richard Bliss: 

So we can put that down as old friends. 

Shep Hyken: 

Which makes us old friends. 

Richard Bliss:

Yes. And so Shep, let's talk about what we're going to talk about today is that you focus on this whole customer experience and you've just written a book. I have a copy of it, I'll Be Back. And you've really focused on this area of the business world. Help my audience understand what that means and where you're coming from. 

Shep Hyken: 

Sure. And by the way, I'll Be Back is number eight in a long list of books that I've written. And I thought about this concept about why do customers come back, and isn't that what we want them to do? And so many companies measure the net promoter score, the customer satisfaction scores, and all of those are very, very important. But what I realize is they're also just their history lessons. It's what happened the last time you were here. And sure, if somebody gives you a high score, the likelihood of them wanting to come back and do business with you is great. 

Shep Hyken: 

But what I thought is why not measure behavior as much as history. What that means is if they say they'd come back, do they come back? And that's the key, recognizing that your customers are going to come back and different customers come back at a different cadence. I use a hair salon as an example,  although I personally don't have much experience. I know you're listening to this, but I do not have hair on the top of my head, but that doesn't mean I can't relate to this. 

Richard Bliss: 

And that doesn't mean that you are not a very attractive man. I'm just saying. 

Shep Hyken: 

Well, thank you very much. Thank you. 

Richard Bliss: 

You're welcome. 

Shep Hyken: 

But my wife goes to the salon to get her hair done. And she does it on a regular cadence. So the salon  knows what kind of a repeat customer she is. They don't know if she's a loyal customer, but they know  she at least comes back. And if she were not to come back in six weeks like she usually does, if they  noticed, why wouldn't they reach out and call her? Why wouldn't they find out, is there a reason you  didn't come back? Because that's very important to know. Is it because maybe she was sick or maybe  she decided there was somebody else? And if she did decide there was someone else, why? What made  her want to switch? 

Shep Hyken: 

Anyway, the point is rather than just measure satisfaction scores, which are history lessons and still very  important, why not take a look at what's happening right now and in the future with the behavior? So  hence, I'll Be Back - How to Get Customers to Come Back Again and Again. That's what that's about. 

Richard Bliss:

And this is a very valid point because so many, not only the net promoter scores and some of these  other scores, but also this manic pursuit of new customers. That's the shiny rock. That's the  measurement. That's the KPI that's used, but not taking into account, "Okay, how much of that was  churned?" How many of those new customers then stayed and lasted? And oftentimes, then keeping  those customers coming back, sometimes the effort isn't made in that. Is that a fair statement? 

Shep Hyken: 

Yeah, a fair statement. And I would go a step further and say it is easier to keep the existing customer  than it is to get a new customer. It's less expensive typically to keep the current customer than it is to try  to go out and get a new one. And you're always going to have churn. For whatever reasons there are,  people will move on. As a matter of fact, I've just next week and not knowing when this is coming out,  but I am writing an article that will come out, and it'll either be out or will have been out. And it's all  about how you get customers to trust you. And so I write a cartoon every week and this is a perfect...  And so I haven't yet finished. I've drawn it, but I haven't gotten the words. 

Shep Hyken: 

So there's an old person with a cane, very, very old person. And they're standing in front of a building  and it says Skydiving Lessons. And this person is basically saying, "I won't be coming here anymore." And  the employee at the skydiving lessons place says, "You've been coming here for over 30 years. You don't  trust us anymore?" And she says, "I've trusted you for the last 30 years to fold my parachute so I can  land safely. It's just, I'm 92 years old, and the doctor said, 'I shouldn't jump out of any more planes.'"  Something to that effect, which means that's the example of we trust you, but there's reasons that  customers leave. And they may have nothing to do with anything other than it's time for them to go on. 

Shep Hyken: 

So you're going to have churn. That's a good reason to churn out. It's when more than 70% of customers  leave because of apathy or rudeness based on one employee's behavior toward that customer, that's a  pretty big number. We got to avoid that side of it. So anyway, I think I'm going down a rabbit hole. I'm  not sure I'm giving you the answer that you wanted. Yep. 

Richard Bliss: 

No, you're doing good. No, no, that works. Because one of the things I shared this in a previous episode,  I'm a Predator fan, the Arnold Schwarzenegger movie, and they just came out. 

Shep Hyken: 

I thought you were like a Nashville Predator's hockey fan. 

Richard Bliss: 

No, no. I live just down from the Shark Tank here in San Jose. So no, the Sharks. 

Shep Hyken: 

All right. So Arnold and Predator. 

Richard Bliss:

Yeah. And they just came out with a prequel to that called Prey, which is showing on Hulu. I am not a  Hulu customer, and so I signed up for four hours. Signed up, got the free trial. 

Shep Hyken: 

Yeah. Did you get the 30-day trial or the 10-day trial? 

Richard Bliss: 

Well, I don't know how long it was, because as soon as the movie was over, I canceled the trial. 

Shep Hyken: 

Oh, no. 

Richard Bliss: 

I was literally on for a couple hours, but I have a ques... So that's part of that churn, right? Is like, "Hey,  we're going to dangle this in front of you. We're going to get you." And so do I count as a new customer?  I guess they will, but I'm not there. But you said something I'm really interested in. And that is, repeat  customers may be different than loyal customers. 

Shep Hyken: 

Yeah. That's a big chapter in the book is that... And by the way, there's nothing wrong with the repeat  customer. We strive to create repeat business, but don't mistake a customer coming back again and  again for a loyal customer. The reason is 

Richard Bliss: 

How do you... Go ahead. 

Shep Hyken: 

You want to know why. Why are they coming back? 

Richard Bliss: 

And how? And how do you know the difference? 

Shep Hyken: 

Well, you ask. You can do different types of surveys, but you need to recognize. So here's an example.  You go to a restaurant and they say, "Hey, thanks for coming. Join our loyalty program," which means  they give you a punch card and "Hey, when you come here five times, the fifth meal is free." Oh, great.  So people keep coming back. And then what that really is a marketing program, not a loyalty program. It  could turn an every once-in-a-while customer into a more frequent customer, and it might even turn  them into a loyal customer. But if you got to recognize that fifth meal that's free across the five meals,  that's a 20% discount, is what that is. It's a discount program. 

Shep Hyken: 

The airlines that give you points when you fly and then you get to redeem maybe after 10, 12 trips, you  got enough points for a free trip, that's like a 10% discount, even though it seems like you're getting a whole free trip. Makes sense? So you've got to wonder if you take away the free punch card where you  get the free meal or you take away the points, is that customer going to come back at the same  frequency? And if they would, then you know that that is loyalty, because it's not about the perks, it's  about the experience. 

Shep Hyken: 

So we need to weigh them, and again, I just need to make this perfectly clear. There is nothing wrong  with marketing and loyalty programs to this type. I think they're very important to drive a pattern of  behavior, get people used to you and, ultimately, so used to you, so comfortable with you and enjoying  the experience so much, that it truly is a perk and not the reason the customer chooses to come back  and do business with you. Does that make sense? 

Richard Bliss: 

It does. And I'm trying to think of my own life. So where does that happen in my own life? Where am I  loyal versus where am I coming back for the perk? 

Shep Hyken: 

I guess before you tell me, I bet the company that you're loyal to, you trust for the predictable and  consistent experience that you like with them. 

Richard Bliss: 

And it has to do with part of their marketing. They started doing a certain marketing. It spoke to me and  I said, "I'm giving that company my business." And supposedly I get points and I get some type of status.  I've never used them. I have no idea how many points I have, but I consistently use that company  whenever I can, because I like and trust the way they do business. 

Shep Hyken: 

Because they made... The marketing message was a promise. And this is what it's all about. A brand is a  promise delivered, and they delivered on the promise and they delivered consistently and predictably.  You know what you're going to get? Why take a chance anywhere else? 

Richard Bliss: 

Well, I have taken a chance otherwhere and I might even get better business, but I like still the promise  they made. And that company for me is Enterprise Car Rental. 

Shep Hyken: 

They're right down the street. Their headquarters are literally one mile from where I am right now. 

Richard Bliss: 

And I have been teaching marketing and brand loyalty for many years as an executive. And for years  when I asked audiences, what's the number one rental car brand? And consistently I always got the  same answer, Hertz. But a little while ago, I was in front of a bunch of college students presenting at a  college class. And I asked that question, expecting my answer to continue to be Hertz. And 100% of the  audience said Enterprise, except for the professor who was about my age. And he said Hertz. And it struck me, because then as I started paying attention to Enterprise, I saw their promise and their  promise was, "Hey, look 

Shep Hyken: 

We look up and 

Richard Bliss: 

Well, that's one, We pick you up. And that's always in the back of my head, although I've never used that  service. They ran a series of ads about student athletes going pro. But the point was, "They're going pro,  but not as an athlete." Look at all these student athletes they're coming out of college. They're all going  

pro, but not as an athlete, as a person contributing and taking a job. And Enterprise said, "Look, we  focus on hiring these new college grads and bringing... And I went, you know what? I'm giving you my  business, because I know how hard it is for a young person to step out, and if you're going to take care  of them. And so now every time I go to an Enterprise, I'm checking out and I'm looking at these young  people. 

Richard Bliss: 

Are they keeping their promise? Are they showing? Am I working with an older seasoned, not against  older seasoned people, but are they keeping their promise that I'm working with young people who  maybe don't quite have the skills and they're trying hard and their learning. And I'm more than willing to  be patient with them because I know and believe in this promise that was made to me. So that's where I  went with. 

Shep Hyken: 

I love that. And by the way, so a little bit more about Enterprise. They are, I believe, the number one on campus recruiter of new talent, anywhere in the country. And let me also tell you what's happening. You  don't realize it, but they stand for something. This is one of their causes and missions. By the way,  they're very philanthropic. They give to the communities that they are in, but here's an interesting stat,  45. And by the way, this comes right out of our achieving customer amazement study that we do every  year. We interview consumers across the country based on different ages and ethnicity and gender and  geography. So we get a really good cross section that's geared toward the census of the United States. 

Shep Hyken: 

So this is a U.S. consumer study, 45% of the people we interviewed believe it's important that a  company has a social cause that's important to them. And this is great. And we can break it down by the  generations, Gen Z and Millennials are really, really high compared to Boomers and even the Gen X.  Now Boomers dramatically. So the point that I'm trying to make with this is that you believe in their  cause, and their cause is turning students into professionals, business professionals. And that's the  cause, because they recognize this is a good thing for America or for any country to have students  coming out, going into a program with a company that likes to promote from within and give people an  opportunity to grow. And boy, when you hear about that, you go, "Wow, I'm going to support that  company." 

Richard Bliss:

I want to be part of that. Right? And so every time I'm like... And even just this week, somebody was  complaining that their car rental, blah, blah, blah. I said, "Who you rent with?" And they said, "Avis." I  said, "Go with Enterprise. Go." And so here I am advocating. I'm not going to get anything from that, but  that would qualify under what you were talking about. Yes, I'm a frequent customer, but I'm also a very  loyal customer. 

Shep Hyken: 

Right. And a loyalty is based on the emotional connection that you have with them because of what they  stand for. It's what you stand for as well. 

Richard Bliss: 

So how does that 

Shep Hyken: 

So that cause could be sustainability. And I'm just writing an article now for my Forbes column about...  The title of it is, I don't like your politics. And it's the reaction that certain customers have toward  companies that publicize what they do. But on the other side of this is customers that do like the  politics. So there's different companies that take on very, very strong stands. Hobby Lobby, Chick-fil-A,  very, very spiritual and religious at what they do. Chick-fil-A closed every Sunday. There's Christian  Brothers Automotive repairs. They believe that family's more important than the job. If you buy their  franchise, you got to promise to close by like 6:30, so you can be home with your family for dinner. 

Richard Bliss: 

Wow. 

Shep Hyken: 

Things like that are very important. Now those are not causes like I believe in giving to charity. I believe  in sustainability. But when you start making political religious stances or make comments like that,  you're going to polarize some of your customers. But then you've got companies like Lush, who don't  believe in animal testing. Well, to many customers, they don't care about that. But to some that do, oh,  my gosh. They're not going to do business with any other type of cosmetic company. So this is an  important thing and you bring it up and you have experienced it firsthand, whether you knew it or not. 

Richard Bliss: 

Oh, yeah. And so the question then is for a company that's looking to tap into this, who's listening to  you, that brings you in, what are some of the pieces of advice then for them to tap into the, as we call it  now, shareholders rather than, excuse me, stakeholders, rather than shareholders, to tap in and to find  those loyalty and how to measure it. And then how to make sure that you are resonating with that  audience and developing that message. What advice do you give to them? 

Shep Hyken: 

Well, first I want to compliment you on your use of the word stakeholder, which has changed because  probably a year or two ago, stakeholder meant shareholder, stakeholder holder meant investor, but  now the stakeholders are your customers, your constituents, your followers, your advocates. And so  what we do, and I'll just put it to you directly there. I can go on and on. I've written, as I mentioned, a number of books on this. But I think first and foremost, you want to gain a level of trust, see customer  amazement and being that amazing company that people will say, "Oh, I love doing business with them.  They're amazing." It's not because they're over the top. Once in a while, there's going to be that over  the top experience when there's a problem that falls in your lap. It's like, if I've got a complaint and you  solve it to my satisfaction the right way, I might even say, "Wow, I trust them even more," now that I  trusted them before. 

Shep Hyken: 

So I know I can complain and I'll get action. And they'll take care of me. Very important to train  customers if that's what you want them to do. But the point is, there's a predictable and consistent  experience that you're meeting my expectations. This is what you want customers to say. "They're  always so knowledgeable. They always call me back quickly. They always are helpful. They're always  friendly." That word always followed by something positive. And by the way, the four things I just  mentioned, they aren't even over the top. They're basic expectations, but you know that common sense  expectation? It's not easy to deliver on unless you're deliberate about the delivery. 

Shep Hyken: 

So companies that create the process, properly train their people, empower them to do the right job,  when they're engaging with customers, they are creating trust. They're creating advocacy. They're  creating repeat business that could eventually lead to loyal business. And of course, if you throw it on  top of that, maybe they have a cause that you're interested or a charity you're involved in, or maybe  they have a hiring practice that you like, as Enterprise does. I think when you add those together, you  start to solidify the loyal customer and separate that from just a repeat customer, which is the beginning  of our conversation. 

Richard Bliss: 

Right. And then it sounds so direct and simple. Yet, Shep, you work with so many companies. 

Shep Hyken: 

Simple does not mean easy. 

Richard Bliss: 

Right. That it's, they're not doing it. What's getting in their way? What's some of those key elements  that's preventing them from being successful? 

Shep Hyken: 

Wow. First of all, they don't take time to create the process and really sit down and understand what it  is. You can't... A long time ago somebody said, "You can't be successful by accident." Oh, you can once  or twice, but if you want to stay in this game long term, you'll realize that accidents happen, positive  accidents maybe. You and I were talking about this great fee that you just got for a speaking  engagement. And I said, "Yeah, all you got to do is do that 50, 60 times a year." And I could see in your  face, "That would be great, but I wonder if that's possible." No. So you can't. Sometimes things fall on  your lap. 

Shep Hyken:

The question you have is, what's preventing people from doing this? Let's start with this. What allows  people to do it rather than prevent it? Because the thing that the companies aren't doing are what  successful companies do. And that is number one, they understand who their customer is. Number two,  they understand the journey their customer takes. They've taken a look at the interaction points, the  moments of truth, if you will, that drive that experience. 

Shep Hyken: 

Many years ago, Jan Carlzon wrote about this in an article that eventually turned into a book. He was  president of Scandinavian Airlines when they were losing a lot of money. And he turned the airline  around to be not only financially successful, but one of the most admired airlines in the industry. And he  did it by teaching all the employees to manage the interactions that passengers have with the airline.  The first major interaction is, and this was before the internet, pick up the phone and make a phone call,  make a reservation. What's that experience like? How long does somebody stay on hold? How friendly is  the agent? How quick do we get the information? Were they thanked and appreciated, the passenger,  at the end of the call? 

Shep Hyken: 

All of these things are part of a pretty big interaction point. And that's just point number one, because  then you've got to go to the airport on the day of departure. You check your bags at the curb. You go  inside of the ticket counter. You're greeted at the gate. You're taking care by the flight attendant. You're  greeted at the destination that you get your bags, right? And all of their... And there may be other  interaction points. You walk up to a Scandinavian Airlines employee and say, "Excuse me, where's the  bathroom?" Okay. Not on the plane. I'm talking about in the airport. Obviously, we know where it is on  the plane. But you get the idea, and maybe a flight attendant walks by and smile and waves at you just  to add to the experience, even though it wasn't necessary. 

Shep Hyken: 

And that by the way is really strategized. Companies like Disney, make sure that every employee, who  they call cast members, know the power of that type of magic, no pun intended. But Disney magic  comes when characters like Snow White or Mickey or even regular cast members who are the  employees who may be working a ride or working behind a concession stand, engage you with eyes and  smile at you and say, "Good morning." Little tiny interactions add up to be something big. As a matter of  fact, Disney, they talk about managing the magic, and I call it the 10 foot five foot rule. If you're within  10 feet of the guest, you're to acknowledge them with a facial expression. That's what Disney teaches. 

Shep Hyken: 

Now I add to that, it needs to be a smile. If you think about it, you're walking by Mickey Mouse and he  scowls at the kid, that's not what they're trying to achieve. And within five feet or so... Now obviously,  some of the characters don't talk, but with... And then in five years, most of the cast members are  supposed to acknowledge somebody verbally by simply saying, "Good morning. Hello. How are you? Oh,  I like that hat," or whatever, as you're walking by. And so you're creating these small little moments that  are positive. Now I call those moments of magic. Magic, not being over the top, blow me away and  surprise me and amaze me, but magic being anything that is a tiny bit better than average. 

Shep Hyken:

The Ritz Carlton defines it as when the bellman learns the name of the guest by just simply looking at  the luggage tag and then says, "Ah, Mr. Bliss. Welcome to the Ritz." How? Wait? Oh, he looked at my  luggage tag. Who cares? It's a little moment of magic. 

Richard Bliss: 

It is. Now in today's world, the challenge is that so often those interactions we have are all online. It's all  in a digital world. 

Shep Hyken: 

Yeah. It's no different though. 

Richard Bliss: 

And it is. And this is what we teach with our classes and you have seen me and that is those small, tiny  interaction, liking somebody's post, leaving a nice comment beyond congrats, but "Hey, you deserve this  award." 

Shep Hyken: 

A thoughtful comment. 

Richard Bliss: 

A thoughtful comment. That's a very well good way of saying it. And I have had pushback, Shep, from  people when I present to them this very simple process of, "Look, these tiny magic moments," as you  call them, and you know what they tell me? They come back so often and say, "Well, that's  manipulative. That's like stalking. We're uncomfortable." And then I have to explain, "No, you do this in  person in real life naturally." You have to learn to feel comfortable doing it naturally. Because the person  on the other end, if you make out a post, your post goes live, and I go comment on it. I ask him, I said,  "Who wants to put content out on there that nobody looks at?" 

Richard Bliss: 

But if you leave a thoughtful comment, you have stepped out of the anonymity of every the audience to  say, "Hey, look. I appreciate what you just did." And now if you're trying to get business out of that  person, man, the notch just went up a little bit that you're going to be recognized much more than the  person next to you. 

Shep Hyken: 

Right. So let's talk about that for a moment, because that's extremely powerful. You're doing... And I'm  going to let in on some of the secret sauce that I have. Okay. 

Richard Bliss: 

All right. 

Shep Hyken: 

The reasons I leave comments on LinkedIn articles and posts, the reason I... I have a top five weekly, I  call it the Top Five. It's a roundup, a weekly roundup of the five favorite articles that I read from last week. And I read anywhere from 8, 10, 12 articles a day that come through my feed, all on customer  service and experience. And what I'm looking for is information that I know my audience will enjoy.  There's also something else I'm looking for. Because my audience is all customer service experience,  

people who are interested in that. So I'm not going to post an article on, I don't know, what other topic,  but it's got to tie into that. So that's first and foremost. 

Shep Hyken: 

But let's say there's a company that has a blog. "You know what? Gosh, that's a fascinating company and  they wrote this great article. I'd like to learn more about that company. I'd love to talk to them." If I post  them, post the article, I put it in the feed. I link back to them and if their communications department is  

doing a good job, they're going to see, "Who is this guy, Shep, that just posted our blog post? Let's find  out more about him." That could start a relationship. By the way, is that an ulterior motive? Honestly, it  is. But at the same time, it doesn't matter, because I know what I can do for them. What they can do if  they engage me, is going to be beneficial to everyone, them, their customers. I feel good about that. 

Shep Hyken: 

When we pick up the telephone and we make a sales call to a prospect, we've never talked to, hence a  cold call. Okay. Do you know how many cold calls we have to make to be able to be seen or heard by the  same number of people that might see my blog post about this company? Or if I leave a comment and I  do it right, and I know the way to do it right, is to say, "Thank you at Richard Bliss." Which now your  name populates so when it shows up in my feed and my LinkedIn feed, they know, "Oh, I'll click on this  Richard Bliss dude and see what Shep's talking about. When we do it right, we're not only doing a  service, at least I feel I'm doing a service to my clients. I also feel like I'm doing a little something special  for my... Maybe I don't even know the guy, Richard Bliss, but maybe that starts a relationship. 

Richard Bliss: 

Absolutely. 

Shep Hyken: 

As a result, I have become... By the way, if I never do business with these people, that's fine too, but I  also recognize it is business. There's a reason many companies decide to get involved with the  community and give back. They pay money for charitable things. They sponsor the school dance or  whatever, because they know that that's going to potentially bring them business. But I know this, that  they feel good about giving anyway, 

Richard Bliss: 

Absolutely. Shep, this has been... We're about out of time. So this has been absolutely fascinating. And  it's always a pleasure to spend some time talking to you about the wide of topics that you have  experience with. As we wrap up, people want to find out more about Shep Hyken. Where are they going  to go to learn more about you? 

Shep Hyken: 

Wow. Just Google me. You can Google Shep. And then a dog will come up, a German Shepherd,  Shepherd Smith from CNBC. And then just go to Hyken.com. H-Y-K-E-N.com. You'll learn everything you  want to know and a whole lot more. And if you want the free research report that we do every year, which by the way, is now sponsored by Amazon Web Services. We love them. Thank you very much,  Amazon. You can download that at no charge, and I think you'll enjoy it. There's a lot of great  information and some fun articles. 

Shep Hyken: 

For example, one of my favorite articles that I wrote on here had to do with... Hold on. Oh, we're talking  about surveys and things like that. The 40% of customers have stopped doing business with the  company because their customer satisfaction survey was too long. It has a little information about the  causes that we talked about. But here's a favorite article that I wrote, Do loyalty programs really create  loyalty? That's a good one, but here's... Where is it? Where is it? It's something like 48% of customers  would rather go to the dentist than call customer support. 

Richard Bliss: 

Yeah, I think you've brought that up before, like nearly half, one out of two people are like, "No, I don't  want to call customer support." And I feel that. 

Shep Hyken: 

46% would rather go. 

Richard Bliss: 

46% would rather go to the dentist. I had that happen the other day. And I finally reached out and, not  to tell this story, but I spent five years in customer support at WordPerfect Corporation for those who  are listening. 

Shep Hyken: 

I remember you telling me that. 

Richard Bliss: 

For five years I took 35,000 phone calls. And so when I get on the phone with a customer support rep,  particularly around a technical problem, I've had them compliment me. Because even though I've  already done everything they're asking me to do, I know that's so important for them and their process,  I got to do it again. "All right. Let me go ahead and go do it." And I'm patient. I had my brother-in-law  one time as we were troubleshooting some technical situations, and we kept failing, failing, failing, as  we were testing. 

Richard Bliss: 

He's like, "I just don't know how you have the patience." And I said, "No, this is progress. Every time we  discover something wrong, we're very much closer, because it's designed to work. So let's just  eliminate." Anyway, my point being that I know that feeling of the customer support, so that 46% does  not surprise me and that works. 

Shep Hyken: 

But I have good news. There's some good news. 

Richard Bliss:

What's that? 

Shep Hyken: 

A silver lining for all this single people out there, 56% of the people we asked gave us this response. If  you are single, the likelihood that you would want to date somebody who gave great customer support,  56% said, "Oh, yes." So those that give great customer service who are single have a shot at meeting the  man, woman or they of their dreams. 

Richard Bliss: 

That movie Red with that guy you look like? 

Shep Hyken: 

Warren Beatty? 

Richard Bliss: 

Bruce Willis. 

Shep Hyken: 

Oh, Bruce Willis. Oh, right. 

Richard Bliss: 

Bruce. Right, Red, they met on customer support. There you go. That's how they met through customer  support. Shep, this has been great. Thank you so much for taking the time. 

Shep Hyken: 

My pleasure. Thank you for having me, man. I always enjoy it. 

Richard Bliss: 

You've been listening to Digital-First Leadership. My guest has been Shep Hyken. We've been talking  about customer service and why customers come back and difference between a frequent customer and  a loyal customer. And particularly in today's digital world, hopefully, you found something useful. You  can go to Hyken, H-Y-K-E-N.com to download his free report on the industry. I'm always inspired by my  guests and today was no different. Hopefully, you were as well. Thanks for listening. Take care. 

Speaker 1: 

You've been listening to Digital-First Leadership, the podcast where you learn to leverage and build your  expertise on digital platforms. For more valuable tips on mastering the language of social media,  subscribe to our newsletter at BlissPointconsult.com. If you'd like to stay in touch, feel free to add  Richard on LinkedIn and join the conversation.